Justice Watch "December 14, 1996 Christmas Party" [ Main ] [ Post New Thread ] [ Help ] [ Search ] Table of Contents ................................................................... December 14, 1996 Christmas Party, ACandyRose, 16:51:24, 8/24/2001 ???, Ginja, 18:27:45, 8/24/2001, (#1) basement catering?, austingirl, 18:36:17, 8/24/2001, (#2) Hey!, Ginja, 18:52:33, 8/24/2001, (#3) basement staging point?, austingirl, 18:59:46, 8/24/2001, (#4) ACR, Tricia, 21:34:31, 8/24/2001, (#5) Dec 13th, Agent99, 05:45:37, 8/25/2001, (#6) Basement of Butler's Kitchen?, Chris, 06:07:33, 8/25/2001, (#7) Party Date, janphi, 06:46:11, 8/25/2001, (#8) I don't believe.., ACandyRose, 09:03:39, 8/25/2001, (#9) 80 or 25?, v_p, 09:31:14, 8/25/2001, (#10) Potluck supper, Twitch, 12:39:27, 8/25/2001, (#11) ACR, Agent99, 14:45:46, 8/25/2001, (#12) No reason, ACandyRose, 17:05:12, 8/25/2001, (#13) ACR, Tricia, 17:23:20, 8/25/2001, (#14) ACR, Ayeka, 11:47:15, 8/27/2001, (#15) Help Please, frankg, 14:05:03, 8/27/2001, (#16) Santa was at......., ACandyRose, 14:15:49, 8/27/2001, (#17) Tks ACR, frankg, 14:23:19, 8/27/2001, (#18) ................................................................... "December 14, 1996 Christmas Party" Posted by ACandyRose on 16:51:24 8/24/2001 Does anybody know anything about this Christmas party that was held in the Ramsey home on December 14, 1996? According to Steve Thomas' book the police didn't even know that a party was in the Ramsey house until over a year after the murder. ST Book Page 266 "On the last day of January, Day 400 of this enternal investigation, Detective Harmer discovered that only ten days before the December 23, 1996, party at the Ramsey house, there had been another function there, with caterers serving eighty people. More than six dozen new potential suspects, and Beckner's orders were to "check every one," even though we didn't know who the hell they were." This was called the "Foyer Group" Christmas party and was catered. Our new Globe star said that all of the Ramsey parties that were catered were done so in the basement of the Ramsey home. So here we have a group party of 80 people and caterers. Hello? Were these caterers set up in the basement of the home on December 14th, 10 days before the murder? I posted this over on Jameson's forum waiting for an answer from her since she stated she mentioned this party in her January Timeline which she states the party was a group of 25+ and she states it wasn't catered and that they ran out of food and Patsy voted to get Pizza. Since she states she has e-mail privileges with John Ramsey I asked her to write to him and ask him about the party. And that leaves more questions. First questions are who were the caterers, how many were there and were they set up in the basement? Second questions would be who was the pizza guy and where did he put all those extra pizza's when he delivered them? Did he take them to the basement since that was the normal central caterers setup location? Also did Patsy allow the guests to wander around the whole house such as giving another of her tours or where the 80 guests restricted to only the first floor of the house? Does anybody recall reading about this party in DOI? [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ EMAIL ACandyRose ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 1. "???" Posted by Ginja on 18:27:45 8/24/2001 Did the Ramseys rent out their home for the dinner? They weren't members of this church or affiliated with it in any way except to allow the churchmembers to come in and use the house for their dinner. So where were the Ramseys during the dinner? Usually when a church group has a function, their members do the work and cooking. As a Catholic, we have the Rosary Society and the Knights of Columbus and whatnot. So whenever there's a holiday dinner or banquet or some such function, one or both of those groups will work together in the planning and pulling it all together. Many a church dinner in the parish hall I've gone in back in the kitchen and helped out. And when there's a K-of-C bar-b-q at someone's house (usually my sister's), I've helped my sister and the other wives setting up tables and putting out the salads. The men like to BS around the grill while they turn over the steaks and chicken. :-) This goes on with the Lion's Club, too, which isn't church-related. The only time churchmembers aren't cooking is when they have the big Christmas Banquets at a large banquet restaurant (where they also have dancing and raffles and whatnot). What I'm getting at is, church funtions aren't catered. Of course, this is most true with churches in my neighborhood. Why waste money on caterers when you can do it yourself? Besides, the money saved is the money we use for charitable causes. Even the leftover food gets wrapped up and brought to the homeless or abused families or whatever. So do we know with any degree of certainty that this function at the Ramsey house was catered? And what are we suggesting? That caterers came in for a church function, cased the joint and figured there was money here, so one of them decided to come back and kidnap a child? Jeesh! I say let them knock themselves out over there with this one, ACR. They throw evidence out the window because they don't like it, and then make up their own to suit their theories. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 2. "basement catering?" Posted by austingirl on 18:36:17 8/24/2001 Why in the world would caterers use the basement for food preparation? There are no food preparation facilities there, no outside entrance (except for one-footed, one-palmed DNA-impaired inturders). And we know it was an over-stuffed pig sty. There was an adequate kitchen, a breakfast room, and a big dining room on the first floor where there were doors which could be used for ingress and egress. Where does this BS come from? [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 3. "Hey!" Posted by Ginja on 18:52:33 8/24/2001 It just dawned on me, otherwise known as I just remembered something....vaguely. Austingirl's got a point, there being no kitchen facilities or anything down in the basement. The foodstuffs and whatnot were kept warmed up and served from the kitchen on the first floor. But wasn't the basement more a staging or hangout area for the employees (from the caterers). [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 4. "basement staging point?" Posted by austingirl on 18:59:46 8/24/2001 From your lips to a prosecutors ears, LOL. I think that's the whole point of this exercise, to place as many "suspects" in the basement, years after the fact, as possible. Never heard a word about this before. The great unwashed staff could have cooled their heels in the lower hallway or "butler's pantry" or even gone outdoors. They might be selling, but I'm not buying. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 5. "ACR" Posted by Tricia on 21:34:31 8/24/2001 I don't remember anything in DOI about this party but I have pretty much blocked out many things in that crap filled piece of puke fluff. Yes that palm and shoe print could have been from someone at the party on Dec 14th. It doesn't point to that person being the killer though. Although the Ramsey would like you to think that. Glad to see your posting ACR Tricia [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 6. "Dec 13th" Posted by Agent99 on 05:47:18 8/25/2001 NOTE: This message was last edited 05:47:18, 8/25/2001 Wouldn't 10 days before the 23rd, be friday, Dec 13th? Not the 14th. From Steve "ten days before the December 23, 1996" I believe Jams is the one pushing the date Dec 14th. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 7. "Basement of Butler's Kitchen?" Posted by Chris on 06:07:33 8/25/2001 I thought that all of the parties were catered from the Butler's Kitchen. That's in the area just inside that door that John Fernie "allegedly" found open...between the spiral staircase and the hallway where the bathroom and door to the basement were located. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 8. "Party Date" Posted by janphi on 06:46:11 8/25/2001 I thought it was the 13th also. The Rams for some reason were at the Home Depot in Athens, GA, on Thursday, 12/12, because ST had a receipt for something they bought there (theory was it was for duct tape). The "sighting" by the store employee saying he/she had seen PR, JR and JBR there always sounded a little hinky, though. At any rate, there was much discussion about what they might have been doing in GA and then flying back to Boulder so quickly when they had this 80-guest party the very next night. Foyer Groups are usually small--I was in one at an Episcopal Church here for a little while and it was very informal. We just got together and had dinner whenever we felt like it. The point was the fellowship, not the hospitality. When I lived in another state, we just did potluck, where each brought something. But we never had more than 10 in our groups. If they had 80 in the group, it must have been several Foyer Groups together having their "Christmas party" at the Rams. Still, it seems kind of odd to have at someone's house who wasn't part of any of the groups (or the one large one, if that's what the deal was). I would have guessed the butler pantry/kitchen, too, as far as staging the buffet platters of food and all that. Wonder where they all ate--12-14 in formal dining; 6-8 in informal dining; 5-6 in that breakfast room at the back; everyone else standing up or seated, with plate in lap? That's a lot to have for a dinner party. Wonder if they actually did come back from GA or if they let friends of theirs be the host/hostess while they were absent. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 9. "I don't believe.." Posted by ACandyRose on 09:03:39 8/25/2001 I don't believe they would have prepared any food in the basement. The area called the "butler's pantry" would be the most logial place I would think for caterers to be setting up the actual food preparation and distribution. I was only going on Jameson's comments that "as a whole", the caterers who normally do the Ramsey parties always used the basement as their central setup space. That could mean it was more of a place for the caterers to store their extra stuff needed. I realize this "Foyer Group" was not a Ramsey party but a group who asked to use the house for their Christmas party. December 14th was on a Saturday in 1996. And if the "normal" was to have caterers use the basement for central setup then I would think that Patsy would direct the caters of this group the same way. I don't know. The party seems to have been shoved under the carpet as far as many knowing about it. I am also only going by the comment in Steve's book about the party being catered. I am not suggesting that any of the Foyer Group party are killers. I am only pointing out that there were a lot of people in that house 10 days prior to the murder between the party on the 14th and of course the party of the 23rd. I do wonder why the Ramseys never told anybody about the party and I am not suggesting they were protecting anybody from that party but there were a lot of people in and out of that house just prior to the murder. And just because there was a boot print and palm print and moved suitcase doesn't necessarily point to the killer if there were multiple people in the basement who could have walked around and/or even moved things. I remember years ago when a friend gave a birthday party for a group of like 50 or so in the basement of a party center and I was video taping the birthday party for the group and I started filming from the time of the preparation which included the group planning the party driving up the basement window of the party center room they rented and handing all the gear, favors, presents, etc. in through the basement window opposed to parking in front and carrying all the stuff through the party center. No, I am not suggesting this happened at the Ramseys house during that party. I am just thinking out loud that any of the party people, caterers, etc. could have went into the basement especially if it was a central setup place or even meeting place on giving team instructions, etc. I would just like to know more about the party and if it was catered and if the caterers had access to the basement. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ EMAIL ACandyRose ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 10. "80 or 25?" Posted by v_p on 09:31:14 8/25/2001 http://www.crosswinds.net/~jameson245/3p/3page27.html#1 [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 11. "Potluck supper" Posted by Twitch on 13:35:29 8/25/2001 NOTE: This message was last edited 13:35:29, 8/25/2001 NOTE: This message was last edited 12:46:04, 8/25/2001 NOTE: This message was last edited 12:42:55, 8/25/2001 So there were no caterers? Sounds like janphi's scenario is probably right for potluck. 25-30 sure seems more likely than 80. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 12. "ACR" Posted by Agent99 on 14:45:46 8/25/2001 Is there any reason you keep promoting the party as being on the 14th..When Steve said in his book that it was 10 days before the 23rd? That would make it on 13th, a Friday that Dec. I agree with you, that, that particular party is never discussed. I would think Ramsey supporters, would be all over it, and the guest that attended. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 13. "No reason" Posted by ACandyRose on 17:05:12 8/25/2001 I think I took the 14th from Jameson's comments but it could have been the 13th. I know the PMPT (pg240) says the duct tape purchase incident in Atlanta was pinpointed to the 12th and Schiller wrote, "the day before the Ramseys returned to Boulder to host a dinner." The 13th was on a Friday. I don't know which day, the 13th or 14th could be the correct day. And just because Schiller says "to host a dinner" doesn't mean it had to be on that Friday but could have used it as a general term. What amazes me is that the Ramseys never mentioning the party. And again like I said I am not suggesting any party members as the killers but it shows that not every stone was unturned in search of any information on their daughter's death. I suppose it wasn't asked so it wasn't told. I don't know where Steve Thomas got the figure of 80 guests or the caterer comment either. I see he has it on pg297 of his paperback book also so when the book was reprinted with revisions the whole story about the number of party of 80 remains in the book. He also states that it was Detective Harmer who discovered the existance of the party. I mean if the Ramseys had been arrested back then, then how convenient it would have been for them to throw that in the faces of the BPD with, "here you didn't even check on these 80(25?) people!" Just to understand my way of thinking, there were two things I always told my kids as they grew up when they came home crying that their best friend told a secret they promised not to tell. One was, "remember that your best friend has another best friend who is not your best friend." My second to them was, "remember that when you bring somebody into your home, into your world, that you trust, that the trust is only extended to your trust of that person and not the people that person is friends with." Maybe it is part of a suspicous nature within me being the daughter of a cop but I have seen a lot in my years and I don't throw out blankets of trust just because somebody is part of a church group. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ EMAIL ACandyRose ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 14. "ACR" Posted by Tricia on 17:23:20 8/25/2001 Has an great point. Whether it was 20 or 80 why didn't the Ramsey's talk about this party? Why didn't they offer up all those who came as suspects? This is really rather odd. Tricia [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 15. "ACR" Posted by Ayeka on 11:47:15 8/27/2001 That's the first thing I thought of reading the first post -- Hm, possible sources for all of those pieces of alleged 'intruder' evidence. Interesting. Thanks! Ayeka [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 16. "Help Please" Posted by frankg on 14:05:03 8/27/2001 My apologies for having not been thinking about this case for a while now but I'm a little confused and don't have any references to spark this failing memory of mine... When was the party that McReynolds played Santa and JonBenet gave him the pixie dust? I thought that was around this time and there were something like 25 guests there. I'm sooo confused. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 17. "Santa was at......." Posted by ACandyRose on 14:15:49 8/27/2001 The Christmas party of the 23rd. This party called the "Foyer party" was not thrown by the Ramseys but was part of the same church group who asked the Ramseys to use their house for the party on the 13th or 14th, not sure which. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ EMAIL ACandyRose ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] 18. "Tks ACR" Posted by frankg on 14:23:19 8/27/2001 I knew that! ...sheesh, that's embarrassing :-( I'm not sure why I thought that party was a week or so before the murder, but now I'm sorry someone woke me up. [ REMOVE ] [ ALERT ] [ EDIT ] [ REPLY ] [ REPLY WITH QUOTE ] [ TOP ] [ MAIN ] ARCHIVE REMOVE